Post pics of tracks in the works for reflex!!

[poidog808]

Welcome back to the scene Poidog!

Yeah it's pretty unfortunate that the servers have been down for well over a month now.  The sale was finalised by the courts last week, so hopefully Nordic are making some gains to get things back up and running again.  They bought a heck of a lot of IPs from THQ, so they've probably got a lot on their plate right now, maybe more than they can handle...

I think it's still too early to give up on Reflex.  Personally, the servers going down hasn't really affected me too much.  I'll still be playing this game even if the servers never come back online.  I just love to work on my own tracks and that's where I get the most enjoyment out of this game.  It would be a shame if the development on the editor were to stop, but it's understandable if the popularity of Reflex were to drop off.

I think, just ride it out.  The servers will be back at some point!

I guess I can agree to that I'll post some screens soon....Its a privateers track out here in Florida...having fun making this one.

[al167]

good to see ya back too poidog808!
ive watched some of your vids, there pretty good!
for me, im trying to learn modeling right now, to make some objects for my first mxs track, but im getting itchy to knock out another reflex track soon too!
cheers al

[mcm2boys]

For me the editor will continue development, it's something i like to do to unwind and is not related to the servers. I'm hoping the servers will come back up - Nordic are making those kinds of noises but who knows. We're looking into possible alternate ways to get online working but not much hope on that happening right now, but again who knows..

[JamieT]

http://reflex-central.com/betatrack_profile.php?track_id=10

An updated version of my track that's in the works...

[AMA_King]

Jamie, I know you are a big boy - so I am going to give you my honest opinion.

At first I thought W T F?
This is a flat copy & paste SX made from "template pieces" like the MCM1 SX editor!!!!

Where is the sweet looking rutted corner - like the screenshot?
Where is the organic, flowing track on the rolling hillside - like the screenshot?

Well, eventually I rode off to the side & found FX ramps & the NAT - but I was still like - meh.

There is a lot of off-camber stuff, but no big air to speak of & no really memorable "oh S H I T" moments or any  rhythm sections that require you to "set-up" your run & the track didn't really "flow" for me. 

While there is a lot of off camber & some very cool rutted corners - they are hard to string together into "sections" in order to judge your entry & exit speed.  This is probably because there are no landmark objects to remind you where you are on the track & it just wasn't fun for me - yet...

I know it is easy to be a critic when I haven't made anything myself, but I hope you appreciate an honest opinion and I hope it helps you think of building tracks in terms of memorable "sections" or highlight areas that have to be put together by landmark objects in order to find your flow...

Anyhoo - thx for the test track!

PS - you know what they say about opinions...
Opinions are like assholes - everybody has one - butt they all stink!

[JamieT]

Hey King,

Thanks for taking the time to test the track and to give an honest opinion!  I appreciate that more than anything, because generally when people don't like something, they feel like they should keep quiet for fear of offending.

You're right about the SX track - it's a cut & paste job with pieces I made in 3ds max.  Generally speaking, the AMA SX tracks are pretty cookie cutter, and for example, you can take a triple from any given track, and replace it with a triple from another track, and it won't make a lot of difference, in my opinion, which is why I've gone that route when making sx tracks.  In a way, I kind of like that cookie cutter element of supercross. 

Can I ask, what is an "Oh S-H-I-T" moment?   I'm not sure what you mean.

I think what throws a lot of people off with my tracks, is the scale I use.  Which is why it doesn't seem like there is any big-air moments.  The step up jump towards the end of the lap is a 40ft vertical step, and 110ft + horizontal jump.  LaRocco's leap at Redbud is around 110ft too.  I know it doesn't feel like big air when compared to the stock tracks for example, but when you compare it to real life scale, it's a pretty decent gap.

I'm not sure what to say about the flow of the track, and I'm just guessing, but I think you might be trying the blast your way around the track, trying to go flat out all the time, which means you end up making mistakes in the ruts..?  You may find that once you slow down and concentrate on hitting smooth precise lines, you find it more enjoyable.  Sorry if that sounds patronising!    I'm assuming that of course, so let me know if this is the case.

Again I'm guessing, but I think you're a guy that prefers tracks that are more "MCM2 style", with some sx style rythm sections, and difficult gaps that require you to hit them at full speed?  This track doesn't really have that feel to it, so I think I can understand why you don't like it, if that's the case.

In terms of landmarks, and memorable sections, I'll keep your comments in mind.  It's easy for me to know what's coming up as I've done so many laps on this now, that it's all routine, so I might need to try and take a look at it from a first time player's point of view.

My philosophy with making tracks, and adding difficulty to a track, is to steer away from that focus of "maximising speed and traction" to find lap time, and go tend towards "smooth lines and bike control" to find lap time.  I don't want this to sound like, "Hey you don't understand how you're suposed to ride this track",  I thought I'd explain my philsophy of how I play this game, and what I enjoy.


I really do appreciate your critque though.  Negative comments, even though I may or may not agree with them, they're always the most valuable comments!  Let me know if any of the above comments are true about your playing style, that way I can get a better understanding about where you're coming from.

Thanks!


Edit :  Here's a video of the lap, in case you wanted to point out any particular sections...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ01YqcXmpk

[AMA_King]

After watching your video I might have been running it backwards!!!!  I probably crashed at some point and got turned around, but never saw that start gate area until I saw your video!  I was just not having much fun and only ran maybe 5-6 laps... 

I like cookie cutter SX tiles too, but "back in the day" there was usually something "extra" or some special hand painted feature or obstacle that was added to some really fun SX tracks in the old MCM2 & MX v ATV days... but that may be an old mans nostalgia too! 

Nothing really crazy though... like a series of sand (colored) whoops that were low & slow vs. another whoops section on the same track that were sharp edge hardpack & really hard to perfect at full tilt boogie, plus some odd-ball wall jumps that lead to tricky rhythm sections, or a series of on-off saddlebacks or section of berm blasting like 45-45-60-90-180 berm sections vs. just 90's & 180's everywhere & then some memorable gap jumps over some landmark object with a short jump right after it that forces you to brake hard & jump short to set up for the next section, etc.   Nat builders really got creative too!  I loved stair step style jumps - up or down - timing was everything & sometimes you could clear crazy stuff with the right timing in the previous sections...

RE: the "Oh S H I T" moments = that would be sort of like LaRoccos Leap when you realize you blew the previous section & there is no way you will make it - OR - you blitzed the previous section & you are gonna' overjump & die!  Other examples are (like you said) unrealistic, fantasy tracks from MCM2 with crazy fast, huge gaps.

I recognize you are not making a fantasy style or balls to the wall fast track, so I'm not judging "fun" based on that or my prefrences because I don't really prefer one over the other... variety is the spice of life!

Some realistic tracks are fun, some aren't - same with the old fantasy tracks...

I loved the bumpy AMA Replicas from Mike (someone - Mike Mach?) - especially Redbud & Glen Helen! 

I also loved "that one guy" from TD (sorry, I forget the name) who added a TON of objects and made some great tracks with really tight trails through the trees & rocks on the side of a mountain & after crossing some bridge and jumping a semi-trailer flat bed ramp over a building you had to clear a ski-jump style gap and stuff like that - he really made some amazing, fun, creative tracks...

I'm glad you explained the scale settings and glad you are building tracks the way you are.  I prefer technical tracks which you describe as "smooth lines and bike control to find lap time".

Maybe if I run the right direction it will be more fun! 

PS - I think I ran some sections in both directions after I had crashed off into oblivion & didn't know my way back to where I was - it's hard to remember without any unique objects... plus I was going balls out the whole time vs. how you rode it because you knew what was around the next corner / over the next hill...

[JamieT]

I forgot to mention too, that the SX you start on, is the Indianapolis 2008 Supercross, and the one hidden at the top of the big hill, is 2009 Atlanta.  That's why there isn't really anything all that unique in terms of obstacles, but I understand what you mean about that, those layouts are pretty bland.  The supercross tracks are more of a 'technical experiment' I guess you could say, rather than me being creative with layouts.

Hehe so you were running backwards huh....   Yeah that can certainly give the track a weird flow.

Yeah if you take it easy at first, then gradually get faster, it'll probably be better, as certain ruts require a very precise line to hit them smoothly.  There aren't many that'll let you lock into and rail whilst you're going full bore.

A couple of other people have requested a "do or die" jump on the track.  I think the closest there is to that sort of thing, is at 1:15 on the video. There's a left hander with an easy double into some big rollers.  Well if you hit the outside line, you can triple into those rollers.  It's not spectacular... but it's the best there is.. hehe.  I'll probably think more about this type of "do or die" jump on the next track I make, as I just want to get this one to a finished state now, so I can move on to something new.  The only thing I'll be doing to this to increase difficulty, is more bumps and more ruts.

Yeah Mike Mach... Legend!!   The other guy you're thinking of was Mike McCue (Harmonic Cycle Design) http://www.harmoniccycle.com/hc/3d-g-mcm2-downloads.htm
His tracks blew my mind!

Let me know if your opinion changes after you've done a few more laps in the right direction.. hehe   An easy mistake to make I guess, cuz like you say, if you go off the track, there are no objects or landmarks to give you reference points to the direction you were travelling.  Also the textures need doing properly, which hopefully will help...

[AMA_King]

That scale conversation segment reminds of many real trail rides I've been on (Colorado, Utah, West Virginia, Missouri, Wisconsin, Indiana & Illinois of all places) where our photos or videos just to not show the degree of incline or decline of the real life "death dealer" obstacles we rode...

By the way, if anyone is near West Virginia, check out my buddies Moto-Hotel along the Buffalo Mountain Trail System = AKA: Hatfield-McCoy Trails.  The owners name is Bill.  We've ridden all over the US. Tell him Troy sent you! 

http://bluegoosesaloon.com

[135Lance]

Hello this is my first time really building a track. I am trying to make a replica of "2013 Anaheim 2 SX." Here is a picture of my height map of what I have so far. Still having some problems with a few jumps, but I'm sure I'll get it the more I practice. Thanks to A167's for making those tutorials  they helped me a lot. Sorry if the picture didn't show up. I'm new to this forum lol..

[135Lance]

Hello this is my first time really building a track. I am trying to make a replica of "2013 Anaheim 2 SX." Here is a picture of my height map of what I have so far. Still having some problems with a few jumps, but I'm sure I'll get it the more I practice. Thanks to A167's for making those tutorials  they helped me a lot. Sorry if the picture didn't show up. I'm new to this forum lol..

Sorry guys I can't seem to get the photo to work.

[JamieT]

Sorry guys I can't seem to get the photo to work.

Hi Lance,

You would need to upload the image to the internet in order for us to see it.  You can use something like http://imageshack.us/ to host the image.  Then you would insert the address of the image in between the [ IMG ] tags like you did before.  The address of the image is given to you once you've uploaded your picture.  Or you could right click on the image in your browser, go to 'properties' and get the URL address from there.

Hope that helps   Look forward to seeing your track.

[135Lance]

Sorry guys I can't seem to get the photo to work.

Hi Lance,

You would need to upload the image to the internet in order for us to see it.  You can use something like http://imageshack.us/ to host the image.  Then you would insert the address of the image in between the [ IMG ] tags like you did before.  The address of the image is given to you once you've uploaded your picture.  Or you could right click on the image in your browser, go to 'properties' and get the URL address from there.

Hope that helps   Look forward to seeing your track.

Hey thanks for the help Jamie I appreciate it  Ok lets give this another try LOL..http://imageshack.us/ 

[al167]

nice track!, a few pointers,
I can see a low on either side of the jumps, zoom in on the particular jump and use image/adjustments/levels in photoshop and drag the little black triangle at the bottom left along the slider to raise the minimum black level of the jump until the colour matches.
also when you transform the jumps, the look crooked. you need to rotate them so there horizontal or vertical, and then stretch/shrink it.

good luck, its good to see another reflex track builder!

[135Lance]

Hey A167, Thanks for the for the advise  I really appreciate it. I will give what you said a try.. Thanks again for your tutorials.

[135Lance]

I noticed that Mototank I think his name is, is already making Anaheim 2. Should I just start making a new one? I don't mind, I just don't wanna take away his hard work if he is making it still. Which 2013 Sx replicas are not being worked on? Thanks.

[JamieT]

I noticed that Mototank I think his name is, is already making Anaheim 2. Should I just start making a new one? I don't mind, I just don't wanna take away his hard work if he is making it still. Which 2013 Sx replicas are not being worked on? Thanks.

The last I spoke to him, he was pretty tied up with other things, so he doesn't have much time to create tracks at the moment.  So to be honest, I doubt he will finish his version.  At the end of the day it doesn't really matter if you both made the same track.  It might be the same layout, but your style of track-creating will be different to his, so they would both be unique.  There's no point throwing away the work you've done up to this point.  There's also no such thing as 'calling dibs' on a track in my opinion.   Keep going with what you have now bud.  I look forward to seeing something ride-able. It's hard to judge a track just by looking at the displacement map.

[135Lance]

Well bad news my photoshop file got corrupted some how, now my track I made won't open. So now I'm in the process of remaking the height map..

[Fixer]

as your 'revising' your  files it's a good practice to save to new files and keeping the previous files for backup

I always used the same names and increment the name ie; my_track_disp_01 ... my_track_disp_02....etc

[135Lance]

as your 'revising' your  files it's a good practice to save to new files and keeping the previous files for backup

I always used the same names and increment the name ie; my_track_disp_01 ... my_track_disp_02....etc

Hey Fixer thanks for the advice. Yeah I'm definitely going to do that for now on.